Comments on: Sourdough for sissies. http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/10/sourdough-for-sissies/ Hot Stuff from King Arthur's Hearth Tue, 16 Mar 2010 14:27:55 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.3.1 By: pathill http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/10/sourdough-for-sissies/#comment-32364 pathill Wed, 27 Jan 2010 12:45:47 +0000 http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/10/sourdough-for-sissies/#comment-32364 I have been trying to make a starter for a week and it's not totally bubbly. It smells good though. How do you know if it's no good. Just not sure if I should throw it away and start again! Help!!!!!!!!! <strong>There are several tips about sourdough on our website at: http://www.kingarthurflour.com/tips/sourdough-primer.html#a5. If these tips don't answer your question, it may be a good opportunity to call and chat with one of our bakers at 802-649-3717. Irene @ KAF</strong> I have been trying to make a starter for a week and it’s not totally bubbly. It smells good though. How do you know if it’s no good. Just not sure if I should throw it away and start again! Help!!!!!!!!!

There are several tips about sourdough on our website at: http://www.kingarthurflour.com/tips/sourdough-primer.html#a5. If these tips don’t answer your question, it may be a good opportunity to call and chat with one of our bakers at 802-649-3717. Irene @ KAF

]]> By: Karen http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/10/sourdough-for-sissies/#comment-28880 Karen Tue, 29 Dec 2009 01:47:53 +0000 http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/10/sourdough-for-sissies/#comment-28880 I made my second batch of the Rustic Sourdough today, the first yesterday did not turn out, I forgot one of the risings, oh well.... Any whoo the dough tonight was very sticky and had to manage, felt like I was wrestling with a big old bear, what did I do wroing? Should I just add more flour? I finally got it on the parchment paper and into the oven after the second rising and it was absolutely delicious, just would like to get it a little less sticky and easier to work with, any suggestions. This site is the best, I have been baking up a storm, making candy, cookies, cakes, etc. Gave all of it away for Christmas treats and have the folks begging for more, thank you so much for all the great recipes/blogs/help. I also like to watch a show on PBS, Cook's Country which is also in the great state of Vermont, do you guys ever work with those guys? I love their recipes too. <strong>Give us a call at the Baker's Hotline for help with the sourdough. We're always happy to help. Molly @ KAF</strong> I made my second batch of the Rustic Sourdough today, the first yesterday did not turn out, I forgot one of the risings, oh well…. Any whoo the dough tonight was very sticky and had to manage, felt like I was wrestling with a big old bear, what did I do wroing? Should I just add more flour? I finally got it on the parchment paper and into the oven after the second rising and it was absolutely delicious, just would like to get it a little less sticky and easier to work with, any suggestions. This site is the best, I have been baking up a storm, making candy, cookies, cakes, etc. Gave all of it away for Christmas treats and have the folks begging for more, thank you so much for all the great recipes/blogs/help.

I also like to watch a show on PBS, Cook’s Country which is also in the great state of Vermont, do you guys ever work with those guys? I love their recipes too.
Give us a call at the Baker’s Hotline for help with the sourdough. We’re always happy to help. Molly @ KAF

]]> By: Heather http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/10/sourdough-for-sissies/#comment-24816 Heather Tue, 24 Nov 2009 04:22:02 +0000 http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/10/sourdough-for-sissies/#comment-24816 I'd love to make sourdough rolls for Thanksgiving dinner -- I was originally thinking about the soft golden rolls but want something a bit more sophisticated. However, I'm worried that the dough will be too slack to shape into rolls without having them smush into each other so much while rising that they just turn into a loaf. I don't care so much about the rolls having large holes, I'm more interested in the flavor -- so should I add a little more flour to make a slightly stiffer dough? Or do you think the rolls will be okay if I leave everything as is? Thanks so much, it's wonderful that you're willing to answer our questions here! <strong>Adding a little flour will definitely make the rolls easier to shape but it may make them heavier. Have a Happy Thanksgiving! Molly @ KAF</strong> I’d love to make sourdough rolls for Thanksgiving dinner — I was originally thinking about the soft golden rolls but want something a bit more sophisticated. However, I’m worried that the dough will be too slack to shape into rolls without having them smush into each other so much while rising that they just turn into a loaf. I don’t care so much about the rolls having large holes, I’m more interested in the flavor — so should I add a little more flour to make a slightly stiffer dough? Or do you think the rolls will be okay if I leave everything as is? Thanks so much, it’s wonderful that you’re willing to answer our questions here!
Adding a little flour will definitely make the rolls easier to shape but it may make them heavier. Have a Happy Thanksgiving! Molly @ KAF

]]> By: Everett Thompson http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/10/sourdough-for-sissies/#comment-24640 Everett Thompson Sat, 21 Nov 2009 16:18:13 +0000 http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/10/sourdough-for-sissies/#comment-24640 I tried the Rustic sourdough bread for the first time. I used all of the KAF ingredients and followed the recipe exactly. I weighed everything. I sprayed with water before baking and used a baking stone. The bread was fine except that the crust was very light in color, almost white, after 30 minutes of baking and an internal temperature of 208 deg F. What should I do to get the rich dark brown crust that I see in your pictures? Thanks Everett <strong>Everett, somehow the yeast managed to consume all the sugar, and there was nothing left to brown. This is a common issue with sourdough breads; they're often very pale. Some people brush with oil before baking, rather than spray with water. Some even apply a chef's torch to the crust afterwards. Best bet is to cut back on the initial rising time a bit, and speed the whole process along so the yeast doesn't eat itself out of house and home before it gets into the oven! Hope this helps - PJH</strong> I tried the Rustic sourdough bread for the first time. I used all of the KAF ingredients and followed the recipe exactly. I weighed everything. I sprayed with water before baking and used a baking stone.

The bread was fine except that the crust was very light in color, almost white, after 30 minutes of baking and an internal temperature of 208 deg F. What should I do to get the rich dark brown crust that I see in your pictures?

Thanks

Everett

Everett, somehow the yeast managed to consume all the sugar, and there was nothing left to brown. This is a common issue with sourdough breads; they’re often very pale. Some people brush with oil before baking, rather than spray with water. Some even apply a chef’s torch to the crust afterwards. Best bet is to cut back on the initial rising time a bit, and speed the whole process along so the yeast doesn’t eat itself out of house and home before it gets into the oven! Hope this helps - PJH

]]> By: Bob Landry http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/10/sourdough-for-sissies/#comment-24332 Bob Landry Wed, 18 Nov 2009 03:32:02 +0000 http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/10/sourdough-for-sissies/#comment-24332 Got my sourdough going well yesterday, and decided to make the sponge for waffles tonight, so I could make them in the morning. Wow! The starter was so glutinous I could barely get it out of the crock and into a measuring cup! So I decided to "thin" it down by reversing the proportion of the "feeding", i.e. 1cup water and 1/2 cup flour. Do you think this will be a problem later on? I would think that the wild yeast will multiply equally in a thin starter as well as in a thick, gluey one. <b>Bob - That is fine to tame your starter by adding more water than flour until you get the right consistency. Just resume to the normal feeding proportions for the next time. Elisabeth @ KAF</b><b> </b> Got my sourdough going well yesterday, and decided to make the sponge for waffles tonight, so I could make them in the morning.
Wow! The starter was so glutinous I could barely get it out of the crock and into a measuring cup! So I decided to “thin” it down by reversing the proportion of the “feeding”, i.e. 1cup water and 1/2 cup flour. Do you think this will be a problem later on? I would think that the wild yeast will multiply equally in a thin starter as well as in a thick, gluey one.

Bob - That is fine to tame your starter by adding more water than flour until you get the right consistency. Just resume to the normal feeding proportions for the next time. Elisabeth @ KAF

]]> By: John D http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/10/sourdough-for-sissies/#comment-24098 John D Mon, 16 Nov 2009 03:01:57 +0000 http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/10/sourdough-for-sissies/#comment-24098 Help! I bought a King Arthur sourdough starter a few months ago and I've been feeding it with King Arthur flour. It's happy, it's active, it froths. Whenever I try to make anything other than pancakes with it, I have a gloppy disaster on my hands. Literally! I've been trying the extra-tangy sourdough recipe that came with the starter. After the four hours per-ferment, the twelve hours in the refrigerator, and the five-hour rise, I inevitably have glop. A couple times, I actually got some under-risen loaves. Usually, I get dough that is too sticky to form into loaves, or to do anything else with. Is my sourdough too acidic and breaking down the gluten? I even tried sweetening my sourdough by knocking it down to 4 ounces and adding 4 ounces each of water and flour (I weigh everything). I'd like to start making sourdough and stop making big gloppy messes that make my garbage can smell wondrously yeasty. <strong>Could be your sourdough is extra-acidic and you're letting everything rise too long; acid eventually does break down gluten. Try our <a href="http://www.kingarthurflour.com/recipes/rustic-sourdough-bread-recipe" rel="nofollow">Rustic Sourdough </a>recipe, mild version; that should take you out of the realm of glop and back into safer territory. Call our Baker's Hotline, 802-649-3717, for more suggesitons, OK? Good luck - PJH</strong> Help! I bought a King Arthur sourdough starter a few months ago and I’ve been feeding it with King Arthur flour. It’s happy, it’s active, it froths.

Whenever I try to make anything other than pancakes with it, I have a gloppy disaster on my hands. Literally!

I’ve been trying the extra-tangy sourdough recipe that came with the starter. After the four hours per-ferment, the twelve hours in the refrigerator, and the five-hour rise, I inevitably have glop.

A couple times, I actually got some under-risen loaves. Usually, I get dough that is too sticky to form into loaves, or to do anything else with. Is my sourdough too acidic and breaking down the gluten? I even tried sweetening my sourdough by knocking it down to 4 ounces and adding 4 ounces each of water and flour (I weigh everything).

I’d like to start making sourdough and stop making big gloppy messes that make my garbage can smell wondrously yeasty.

Could be your sourdough is extra-acidic and you’re letting everything rise too long; acid eventually does break down gluten. Try our Rustic Sourdough recipe, mild version; that should take you out of the realm of glop and back into safer territory. Call our Baker’s Hotline, 802-649-3717, for more suggesitons, OK? Good luck - PJH

]]> By: Ron http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/10/sourdough-for-sissies/#comment-23792 Ron Fri, 13 Nov 2009 19:52:10 +0000 http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/10/sourdough-for-sissies/#comment-23792 PJ - While babysitting my grandson, I was reading through my daughter's copy of the KA All Purpose Baking Book. I was glad to see that you were such a driving force for it. I looked at the sourdough waffle recipe, and the weights didn't seem right. It said a cup of starter was 16 oz, but I have been using 8 oz as a weight. It also seems to say the buttermilk weight was different than what was shown in the front of the book. Was that corrected later? Also, the section on sourdough starter indicates using 8 oz of flour and 8 oz of water when feeding, different than we do now. Is the one I saw an older edition and corrections have been made? Did you change the ratios for starters after the book was written etc. I didn't get a chance to look at it for long, but know what I want for Christmas now. Thanks - Ron <strong>Ron, there were indeed some corrections made in subsequent printings. I think your best bet is to call our customer service folks, 800-827-6836, and ask for the "errata sheet" that goes with the KA Baker's Companion cookbook. In the meantime, I'll take a look at it, too, see if it includes what you mention above. Thanks for your kind words - and thanks for your eagle-eyed input! PJH</strong> <strong>Hi again, Ron - I found out the sourdough waffle corrections are on an errata sheet, available simply by calling customer service at 800-827-6836. It should be 2 cups (16 ounces) buttermilk and 1 cup (8 ounces) starter. You can feed your starter either way you like - 1 cup to 1 cup by volume, or equal parts by weight. You'll eventually get a thinner starter if you feed using the volume method. I prefer the 1/2 cup (4 ounces) water/1 cup (4 ounces) flour feeding. Hope this helps - PJH</strong> PJ - While babysitting my grandson, I was reading through my daughter’s copy of the KA All Purpose Baking Book. I was glad to see that you were such a driving force for it. I looked at the sourdough waffle recipe, and the weights didn’t seem right. It said a cup of starter was 16 oz, but I have been using 8 oz as a weight. It also seems to say the buttermilk weight was different than what was shown in the front of the book. Was that corrected later? Also, the section on sourdough starter indicates using 8 oz of flour and 8 oz of water when feeding, different than we do now. Is the one I saw an older edition and corrections have been made? Did you change the ratios for starters after the book was written etc. I didn’t get a chance to look at it for long, but know what I want for Christmas now. Thanks - Ron

Ron, there were indeed some corrections made in subsequent printings. I think your best bet is to call our customer service folks, 800-827-6836, and ask for the “errata sheet” that goes with the KA Baker’s Companion cookbook. In the meantime, I’ll take a look at it, too, see if it includes what you mention above. Thanks for your kind words - and thanks for your eagle-eyed input! PJH

Hi again, Ron - I found out the sourdough waffle corrections are on an errata sheet, available simply by calling customer service at 800-827-6836. It should be 2 cups (16 ounces) buttermilk and 1 cup (8 ounces) starter. You can feed your starter either way you like - 1 cup to 1 cup by volume, or equal parts by weight. You’ll eventually get a thinner starter if you feed using the volume method. I prefer the 1/2 cup (4 ounces) water/1 cup (4 ounces) flour feeding. Hope this helps - PJH

]]> By: Ron http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/10/sourdough-for-sissies/#comment-23226 Ron Sat, 07 Nov 2009 05:28:47 +0000 http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/10/sourdough-for-sissies/#comment-23226 PJ - I've been baking all the bread for two families these days, and all of it is sourdough of some kind. Although I am still doing the KA baguette recipe from the class with a half sourdough starter poolish, I have been working on the whole wheat rustic sourdough every week also. I have found 2/3 all purpose and 1/3 whole wheat has given me the right consistency crust and inside. Last night I made a fed starter with 12 oz of unfed starter, 6 oz flour and 6 oz water, basically a triple recipe. Tonight I mixed all the water with the starter, mixed the dry ingredients in a separate bowl first so the flours were blended, added to the starter etc. I made 2 loaves in 4x8 pans, 2 round hearth loaves, and 2 baguettes from this recipe. I do the baguettes first in the hotter oven for 22 minutes, steaming the 1st 5 minutes, then the 4 loaves(sprayed and sliced) in the 425 oven. Baguette crust was great, loaves are perfect. I have been making larger batches with several different shapes from the same dough for a while now, and it has been lots of fun. By the way, thanks for the sourdough pizza crust recipe in the email today. I am anxious to try it, especially because it uses unfed starter, which I have plenty of. I am still taking all my removed starter and creating some to give away. Spread the joy as they say. I think my next thing will be to work on a sourdough rye or pumpernickel. I'm back in the banter, and looking forward to a long baking winter. Ron <strong>Welcome back, Ron - you sound like you're well on the way to becoming a "breadie;" - in fact, you're probably already there. Fun, isn't it? And the winters don't seem nearly as long when you can look forward to lighting the oven and getting your hands into some dough... PJH </strong> PJ - I’ve been baking all the bread for two families these days, and all of it is sourdough of some kind. Although I am still doing the KA baguette recipe from the class with a half sourdough starter poolish, I have been working on the whole wheat rustic sourdough every week also. I have found 2/3 all purpose and 1/3 whole wheat has given me the right consistency crust and inside.
Last night I made a fed starter with 12 oz of unfed starter, 6 oz flour and 6 oz water, basically a triple recipe. Tonight I mixed all the water with the starter, mixed the dry ingredients in a separate bowl first so the flours were blended, added to the starter etc. I made 2 loaves in 4×8 pans, 2 round hearth loaves, and 2 baguettes from this recipe. I do the baguettes first in the hotter oven for 22 minutes, steaming the 1st 5 minutes, then the 4 loaves(sprayed and sliced) in the 425 oven. Baguette crust was great, loaves are perfect. I have been making larger batches with several different shapes from the same dough for a while now, and it has been lots of fun.
By the way, thanks for the sourdough pizza crust recipe in the email today. I am anxious to try it, especially because it uses unfed starter, which I have plenty of. I am still taking all my removed starter and creating some to give away. Spread the joy as they say.
I think my next thing will be to work on a sourdough rye or pumpernickel. I’m back in the banter, and looking forward to a long baking winter. Ron

Welcome back, Ron - you sound like you’re well on the way to becoming a “breadie;” - in fact, you’re probably already there. Fun, isn’t it? And the winters don’t seem nearly as long when you can look forward to lighting the oven and getting your hands into some dough… PJH

]]> By: Colleen http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/10/sourdough-for-sissies/#comment-22082 Colleen Mon, 19 Oct 2009 19:37:05 +0000 http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/10/sourdough-for-sissies/#comment-22082 Hi PJ- Thanks again for a wonderful blog! I had a neighbor give me an Amish Friendship Bread starter and recipe a few weeks ago. I just got around to baking it today, and I have to say I'm really disappointed. I feel like I just wasted perfectly good starter to make a sweet quick bread. So, I searched your site and came up with a recipe for real sourdough BREAD. The kind where the yeast actually does the work of rising. Thanks for being such a great resource, I knew I could count on you! Hi PJ- Thanks again for a wonderful blog! I had a neighbor give me an Amish Friendship Bread starter and recipe a few weeks ago. I just got around to baking it today, and I have to say I’m really disappointed. I feel like I just wasted perfectly good starter to make a sweet quick bread. So, I searched your site and came up with a recipe for real sourdough BREAD. The kind where the yeast actually does the work of rising. Thanks for being such a great resource, I knew I could count on you!

]]> By: cheryl http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/10/sourdough-for-sissies/#comment-22000 cheryl Sat, 17 Oct 2009 20:10:19 +0000 http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/10/sourdough-for-sissies/#comment-22000 Hi! I was wondering if I used a different flour, say the Italian flour you guys sell (I also have the French, Artisan, Sir Lancelot, AP, etc....) would the starter take on a different flavor? I also read that when you purchase a sourdough starter that after a little time it will live off of the organisms in my locale, not the original ones sent with the starter? Does that make sense? I may have worded that wrong. Thanks! <strong>Exactly right, Cheryl - the sourdough will take on characteristics of where you live. San Francisco sourdough can really only be enjoyed in San Francisco. But only YOU and your friends and family can enjoy sourdough chez Cheryl. :) As for flour, it's not a good idea to substitute one for another unless they have the same or very similar protein levels (or unless you're ready to compensate for their different protein levels by adjusting the liquid in the recipe). For example, Italian flour has a much lower protein level than all-purpose; it's designed for pizza, pasta, breadsticks, and other flat breads, not high-rising loaves. Lancelot would be fine, but you'd have to add a lot more water. Artisan and French would be quite similar to AP, and you might try substituting one of them. Experiment - enjoy! PJH</strong> Hi!
I was wondering if I used a different flour, say the Italian flour you guys sell (I also have the French, Artisan, Sir Lancelot, AP, etc….) would the starter take on a different flavor? I also read that when you purchase a sourdough starter that after a little time it will live off of the organisms in my locale, not the original ones sent with the starter? Does that make sense? I may have worded that wrong. Thanks!

Exactly right, Cheryl - the sourdough will take on characteristics of where you live. San Francisco sourdough can really only be enjoyed in San Francisco. But only YOU and your friends and family can enjoy sourdough chez Cheryl. :) As for flour, it’s not a good idea to substitute one for another unless they have the same or very similar protein levels (or unless you’re ready to compensate for their different protein levels by adjusting the liquid in the recipe). For example, Italian flour has a much lower protein level than all-purpose; it’s designed for pizza, pasta, breadsticks, and other flat breads, not high-rising loaves. Lancelot would be fine, but you’d have to add a lot more water. Artisan and French would be quite similar to AP, and you might try substituting one of them. Experiment - enjoy! PJH

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