Comments on: “How do you make that bread with the big holes?” Secrets of ciabatta revealed. http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/22/%e2%80%9chow-do-you-make-that-bread-with-the-big-holes%e2%80%9d-secrets-of-ciabatta-revealed/ Step-by-step recipes and baking tips from America's oldest flour company: King Arthur Flour Mon, 13 Feb 2012 22:12:57 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Gwen http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/22/%e2%80%9chow-do-you-make-that-bread-with-the-big-holes%e2%80%9d-secrets-of-ciabatta-revealed/comment-page-2/#comment-56468 Gwen Tue, 08 Mar 2011 18:38:03 +0000 http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/22/%e2%80%9chow-do-you-make-that-bread-with-the-big-holes%e2%80%9d-secrets-of-ciabatta-revealed/#comment-56468 I'm a college student, and unfortunately I don't have a nicer mixer (although I think I might get one as a graduation present!). Can I still make the dough with a simple handheld mixer with the basic beaters? Thanks! <strong>Yes, I'd think this would work just fine, Gwen. Have fun, and enjoy the ciabatta. PJH</strong> I’m a college student, and unfortunately I don’t have a nicer mixer (although I think I might get one as a graduation present!). Can I still make the dough with a simple handheld mixer with the basic beaters? Thanks!

Yes, I’d think this would work just fine, Gwen. Have fun, and enjoy the ciabatta. PJH

]]> By: jlamb814386 http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/22/%e2%80%9chow-do-you-make-that-bread-with-the-big-holes%e2%80%9d-secrets-of-ciabatta-revealed/comment-page-2/#comment-55754 jlamb814386 Mon, 14 Feb 2011 15:53:59 +0000 http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/22/%e2%80%9chow-do-you-make-that-bread-with-the-big-holes%e2%80%9d-secrets-of-ciabatta-revealed/#comment-55754 I have a Bosh mixer. Great mixer but only two speeds - fast and super fast. I have a dough hook and cookie dough blades. Which would be best to use for Ciabatta. I also have a Zo bread machine. Would that be a better choice. Thanks, J <strong>I'd use either - the Bosch on the slower speed using the dough hook, or the bread machine. PJH</strong> I have a Bosh mixer. Great mixer but only two speeds – fast and super fast. I have a dough hook and cookie dough blades. Which would be best to use for Ciabatta. I also have a Zo bread machine. Would that be a better choice. Thanks, J

I’d use either – the Bosch on the slower speed using the dough hook, or the bread machine. PJH

]]> By: gary darcy http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/22/%e2%80%9chow-do-you-make-that-bread-with-the-big-holes%e2%80%9d-secrets-of-ciabatta-revealed/comment-page-2/#comment-47580 gary darcy Tue, 29 Jun 2010 05:51:09 +0000 http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/22/%e2%80%9chow-do-you-make-that-bread-with-the-big-holes%e2%80%9d-secrets-of-ciabatta-revealed/#comment-47580 no , have not yet tried .do you have a recipe for yeast donuts that can be filled with jam. thanks gary <strong>Hi Gary, Just pop an email to bakers@kingarthurflour.com with recipe requests, and we'll be glad to help you out the best we can. ~ MaryJane </strong> no , have not yet tried .do you have a recipe for yeast donuts that can be filled with jam. thanks gary
Hi Gary,
Just pop an email to bakers@kingarthurflour.com with recipe requests, and we’ll be glad to help you out the best we can. ~ MaryJane

]]> By: gary darcy http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/22/%e2%80%9chow-do-you-make-that-bread-with-the-big-holes%e2%80%9d-secrets-of-ciabatta-revealed/comment-page-2/#comment-47326 gary darcy Sat, 26 Jun 2010 00:41:05 +0000 http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/22/%e2%80%9chow-do-you-make-that-bread-with-the-big-holes%e2%80%9d-secrets-of-ciabatta-revealed/#comment-47326 could you use a similar dough to make donuts? i find donuts to dense and would like to have larger air pockets thanks gary <strong>Gary, they'd be very atypical doughnuts; most yeast-raised doughnuts have quite a bit of fat in the dough, while this is practically fat-free. I think they'd be rather tough. Have you made yeast doughnuts in the past, or cake doughnuts? Yeast doughnuts are lighter than cake doughnuts; PJH</strong> could you use a similar dough to make donuts? i find donuts to dense and would like to have larger air pockets
thanks gary

Gary, they’d be very atypical doughnuts; most yeast-raised doughnuts have quite a bit of fat in the dough, while this is practically fat-free. I think they’d be rather tough. Have you made yeast doughnuts in the past, or cake doughnuts? Yeast doughnuts are lighter than cake doughnuts; PJH

]]> By: Recipe http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/22/%e2%80%9chow-do-you-make-that-bread-with-the-big-holes%e2%80%9d-secrets-of-ciabatta-revealed/comment-page-2/#comment-33100 Recipe Tue, 09 Feb 2010 16:57:38 +0000 http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/22/%e2%80%9chow-do-you-make-that-bread-with-the-big-holes%e2%80%9d-secrets-of-ciabatta-revealed/#comment-33100 Where is the recipe for this bread? <strong>Click <a href="http://www.kingarthurflour.com/recipes/ciabatta-three-ways-recipe" rel="nofollow">here</a> for the recipe. Molly @ KAF</strong> Where is the recipe for this bread?
Click here for the recipe. Molly @ KAF

]]> By: Beau http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/22/%e2%80%9chow-do-you-make-that-bread-with-the-big-holes%e2%80%9d-secrets-of-ciabatta-revealed/comment-page-2/#comment-28308 Beau Wed, 23 Dec 2009 13:09:02 +0000 http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/22/%e2%80%9chow-do-you-make-that-bread-with-the-big-holes%e2%80%9d-secrets-of-ciabatta-revealed/#comment-28308 I am asking this question prior to making my breads. Last night I did 2 bowls of starter, one for the ciabbata, and one for your golden focaccia. Can I follow your recipes and make the dough, then put it in the fridge, shaped and on bakers sheets? Then the next day pull the pan out of fridge and let the dough rise then put in oven and bake. Will being refrigerated overnight ruin the results. I also bought a bag of French-style flour and Italian-style flour. Would the Italian flour be suitable as a substitute to the regular KA flour? Will there be any difference in taste by using the specialty flours? Can't wait to make these loaves, but wanted to hear from you first. Thanks <strong>Beau, that should work; the breads will gradually rise in the fridge overnight, so I wouldn't give them much of a rise once they're shaped; just cover and refrigerate. Overnight refrigeration will actually improve their flavor. Use French-style flour where you'd use all-purpose flour, in breads. Should be no difference in taste, or just slight; French-style may rise a bit better. Use Italian-style flour for flatter breads - bread sticks and pizza especially; and fresh pasta. You would definitely NOT substitute Italian flour for AP - it's a substitute for Italian 00 flour, which you'll find called for in Italian recipes. PJH</strong> I am asking this question prior to making my breads. Last night I did 2 bowls of starter, one for the ciabbata, and one for your golden focaccia.
Can I follow your recipes and make the dough, then put it in the fridge, shaped and on bakers sheets? Then the next day pull the pan out of fridge and let the dough rise then put in oven and bake. Will being refrigerated overnight ruin the results.
I also bought a bag of French-style flour and Italian-style flour. Would the Italian flour be suitable as a substitute to the regular KA flour?
Will there be any difference in taste by using the specialty flours?
Can’t wait to make these loaves, but wanted to hear from you first.
Thanks

Beau, that should work; the breads will gradually rise in the fridge overnight, so I wouldn’t give them much of a rise once they’re shaped; just cover and refrigerate. Overnight refrigeration will actually improve their flavor. Use French-style flour where you’d use all-purpose flour, in breads. Should be no difference in taste, or just slight; French-style may rise a bit better. Use Italian-style flour for flatter breads – bread sticks and pizza especially; and fresh pasta. You would definitely NOT substitute Italian flour for AP – it’s a substitute for Italian 00 flour, which you’ll find called for in Italian recipes. PJH

]]> By: Gian http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/22/%e2%80%9chow-do-you-make-that-bread-with-the-big-holes%e2%80%9d-secrets-of-ciabatta-revealed/comment-page-1/#comment-27338 Gian Thu, 17 Dec 2009 01:02:15 +0000 http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/22/%e2%80%9chow-do-you-make-that-bread-with-the-big-holes%e2%80%9d-secrets-of-ciabatta-revealed/#comment-27338 PJH- I'm doubling the recipe next time, those two little loaves never had a chance, they were gone in two days! I only substituted the yeast in the starter part of the recipe, the rest of the bread recipe I followed as is, almost. I added 3tsp of vital wheat gluten, suspecting it's the gluten that causes the big holes. Maybe not, I didn't get BIG holes like in that very first pic above but I did get a decent variation in holeyness. The crust came out excellent, so crispy and oh so thin and the flavor was great. <strong>COOL, Gian. Glad to hear you're experimenting and figuring out what makes a great loaf of bread - PJH</strong> PJH- I’m doubling the recipe next time, those two little loaves never had a chance, they were gone in two days! I only substituted the yeast in the starter part of the recipe, the rest of the bread recipe I followed as is, almost. I added 3tsp of vital wheat gluten, suspecting it’s the gluten that causes the big holes. Maybe not, I didn’t get BIG holes like in that very first pic above but I did get a decent variation in holeyness. The crust came out excellent, so crispy and oh so thin and the flavor was great.

COOL, Gian. Glad to hear you’re experimenting and figuring out what makes a great loaf of bread – PJH

]]> By: Gian http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/22/%e2%80%9chow-do-you-make-that-bread-with-the-big-holes%e2%80%9d-secrets-of-ciabatta-revealed/comment-page-1/#comment-26692 Gian Sun, 13 Dec 2009 23:16:20 +0000 http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/22/%e2%80%9chow-do-you-make-that-bread-with-the-big-holes%e2%80%9d-secrets-of-ciabatta-revealed/#comment-26692 Susan said she used 6.5 oz of fed sourdough starter instead of the over night starter. I weighed out that amount of my starter and it seemed to be a very small amount. It seemed to make sense that the starter would replace 6.25 oz of flour and the yeast but what about the 8 oz of water? I made up the difference with another 6 oz of my fed starter. Hope it works, I'll let you know. I've been trying to get big holes in my bread and everyone loves the sourdough flavor. Is the big holes from the slackness or from lots of gluten formation? Or both? It'll be fun trying. <strong>Hi Gian - Starter would replace half water/half flour by weight - so about 3+ ounces of flour (about 3/4 cup), and 3+ ounces of water (generous 1/3 cup). You wouldn't usually use it to replace the yeast, unless you were prepared to give the bread several long rises. Big holes are always a mystery; and one I haven't quite solved yet. Often they're the result of a slacker dough, but not always; you can get bug holes form a less-slack dough, too. And you're right- experiments are always tasty and interesting! PJH</strong> Susan said she used 6.5 oz of fed sourdough starter instead of the over night starter. I weighed out that amount of my starter and it seemed to be a very small amount. It seemed to make sense that the starter would replace 6.25 oz of flour and the yeast but what about the 8 oz of water? I made up the difference with another 6 oz of my fed starter. Hope it works, I’ll let you know. I’ve been trying to get big holes in my bread and everyone loves the sourdough flavor. Is the big holes from the slackness or from lots of gluten formation? Or both? It’ll be fun trying.

Hi Gian – Starter would replace half water/half flour by weight – so about 3+ ounces of flour (about 3/4 cup), and 3+ ounces of water (generous 1/3 cup). You wouldn’t usually use it to replace the yeast, unless you were prepared to give the bread several long rises. Big holes are always a mystery; and one I haven’t quite solved yet. Often they’re the result of a slacker dough, but not always; you can get bug holes form a less-slack dough, too. And you’re right- experiments are always tasty and interesting! PJH

]]> By: Shiyiya http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/22/%e2%80%9chow-do-you-make-that-bread-with-the-big-holes%e2%80%9d-secrets-of-ciabatta-revealed/comment-page-1/#comment-18264 Shiyiya Fri, 07 Aug 2009 13:46:30 +0000 http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/22/%e2%80%9chow-do-you-make-that-bread-with-the-big-holes%e2%80%9d-secrets-of-ciabatta-revealed/#comment-18264 I've made this several times for me and my parents, letting the starter go for up to 24 hours (I likes the yeasty flavour!), and it was wonderful. My dad said the first batch I made was the best ciabatta he'd ever had ^_________^ It's really fascinating how you mix the ingredients into a wet batter, let the kitchenaid work for ten minutes, and have a coherent (and very sticky) dough! Gluten is cool. <strong>Gluten does indeed ROCK. PJH</strong> I’ve made this several times for me and my parents, letting the starter go for up to 24 hours (I likes the yeasty flavour!), and it was wonderful. My dad said the first batch I made was the best ciabatta he’d ever had ^_________^

It’s really fascinating how you mix the ingredients into a wet batter, let the kitchenaid work for ten minutes, and have a coherent (and very sticky) dough! Gluten is cool.

Gluten does indeed ROCK. PJH

]]> By: Lynne Wesolowski http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/22/%e2%80%9chow-do-you-make-that-bread-with-the-big-holes%e2%80%9d-secrets-of-ciabatta-revealed/comment-page-1/#comment-14168 Lynne Wesolowski Tue, 26 May 2009 22:47:16 +0000 http://blog.kingarthurflour.com/2008/09/22/%e2%80%9chow-do-you-make-that-bread-with-the-big-holes%e2%80%9d-secrets-of-ciabatta-revealed/#comment-14168 In general, my hearth-style breads never get as golden as I'd like, even when they are completely baked. They look anemic and unappealing. Somewhere in K-A's website I once came across tips to get that golden color for these loaves. Can you bring them back for me? Thanks! <strong>Sorry, Lynne, don't quite know what you're talking about - try our <a href="http://www.kingarthurflour.com/tips/" rel="nofollow">baking tips</a> section, see if that's what you remember. Could be you're letting the dough rise too long; if it rises too long (total - in the bowl, and once shaped), the yeast consumes all of the sugar; and since sugar is what helps crust brown, the crust won't brown well. Try for a shorter amount of rising time; or bake at a higher temperature. You can also try brushing the crust with milk or oil before baking, or even a beaten egg... PJH</strong> In general, my hearth-style breads never get as golden as I’d like, even when they are completely baked. They look anemic and unappealing.

Somewhere in K-A’s website I once came across tips to get that golden color for these loaves. Can you bring them back for me? Thanks!

Sorry, Lynne, don’t quite know what you’re talking about – try our baking tips section, see if that’s what you remember. Could be you’re letting the dough rise too long; if it rises too long (total – in the bowl, and once shaped), the yeast consumes all of the sugar; and since sugar is what helps crust brown, the crust won’t brown well. Try for a shorter amount of rising time; or bake at a higher temperature. You can also try brushing the crust with milk or oil before baking, or even a beaten egg… PJH

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